Boots or no boots?

[Bearpilot]

I got into multi-engine flying in general because of an unexpected encounter with ice years ago. Since that incident all the planes I have owned have de-ice boots. Only a few were certified known-ice, and I never knowingly fly into areas forecast worse than Light ("occasional moderate" is OK, but usually with a re-route to avoid the mountains) even in K-I planes.

I told myself I would never own a plane that didn't have deicing equipment, and in bigger planes having them was critical. However, recently ice hasn't been a factor in my flying. I have never popped the boots on the P210 I'm flying now in real icing conditions (I do test them on every flight). In almost 3 years I have canceled only two P210 flights because of forecast ice.

The P337 I'm looking at does not have boots (although it's "plumbed" for them). It looks like a dynamite plane otherwise, and it does have a windshield hot plate and front prop deicers. I'm afraid I'm wussing out if I don't stick to my pledge of only flying planes with boots, but I'd hate to pass on a good plane that would be just as serviceable as the P210 I'm in now with the added safety of a second engine.

Anyone have any flights where you didn't have boots and wished you had, or are we all just avoiding icing conditions like the plague? My feeling is to forego the boots this time and just adjust the mission to accommodate the equipment, just as I've been doing for 3 years now in a single.

[WebMaster]

Dale,
If it is truly plumbed for De-Ice, then at some point in time, the boots were removed. Assuming the entire system is fine, getting them put back on is about $14K.

The skymaster has a large horizontal stabilizer, and it tends to accumulate snow or ice. I have been in situations were I was in snow, not ice, and could feel the tail getting heavy. Cycle the boots and everything is fine. I would suggest, that since you are in KMEV, that you get boots on the plane you buy, or buy a plane with boots. I have been in 3, I think, situations (over 5 years) where not having boots would have substantially changed the end result of my flight.

I live in SW Michigan, and I think boots are absolutely essential. I can't imagine living where you do, and flying in the winter without boots.

[KyleTownsend]

If it is truly plumbed for De-Ice, then at some point in time, the boots were removed. Assuming the entire system is fine, getting them put back on is about $14K.

It is my understanding that some 337's came from the factory with "partial plumbing." It is relatively simple to add boots to these airplanes as long as you are willing to write the check. On 337's without partial plumbing, it is a pretty big deal, and probably cost prohibitive.

[sunnysky]

My 337 has boots and I have used them several times in icing. However I find the main problem in icing conditions is overheating of the rear engine, caused by ( I think) a build up of ice around the rear engine air intake and the associated lower airspeed of an iced up airframe. Anyone else had these problems in iceing ?
Sunnysky.

[Mark Hislop]

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If it is truly plumbed for De-Ice, then at some point in time, the boots were removed. Assuming the entire system is fine, getting them put back on is about $14K.
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It is my understanding that some 337's came from the factory with "partial plumbing." It is relatively simple to add boots to these airplanes as long as you are willing to write the check. On 337's without partial plumbing, it is a pretty big deal, and probably cost prohibitive.
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My aircraft has factory "partial Plumbing. It came with a hot prop, ice light, heated pitot tube, windshield hot plate, and a blank hole where the "de-ice" switch should go. I think it also has a tube mounted down the boom, but no tubing I can find in the wings.

What it doesn't have, and what you would need to complete the icing package, are new vacuum pumps (larger than those currently on the aircraft), a timing valve, boots for the wings and horizontal stab, and probably more plumbing.

Cessna used to have a Service Kit that included all of these parts. They don't have it any more. When I bought my aircraft in 1996, I tried to find all the the parts from independant sources. I managed (barely) to find them all, but the cost at that time was over $30,000. My heart won't take the strain of imagining what the cost would be now.

Mark

[Dave Underwood]

I had one serious icing experience which then prompted me to replace the boots and get the whole system working. During the encounter there was a lot of shaking from buildups on the tail plane. We landed fast and still had a couple of inches of mixed on the leading edge. Not nice.

Since getting everything working, it has only been trace to light icing, but having some ice protection available is a really good feeling. The hot plate is great as well and if you have one, better than forking out $4 k for a new one.

On getting the bits, the biggest expense is the boots themselves. If you are missing other stuff, check with the folks parting out planes and I think you will be able to find most of what you need at reasonable prices. There are also some parts which have Piper equivilents and they are much cheaper. There are also some folks selling off surplus stuff which saves you money. Ernie has some pretty good suggestions on his site.

In respect to the plane you are looking at, check the original equip list and see if it came with boots originally and get the parts manual out and survey exactly what is missing. If just the boots, you are in good shape. You can then cost it out and make your decision.

Dave