Deicing - what is required besides plumbing?

[Kevin McDole]

Originally posted by SkyKing
Why? ... is plumbed for boots ...

Does anyone have any experience installing boots on an aircraft that had ONLY been plumbed for boots?

[Bob Cook]

SkyKing

I investigated when looking at various aircraft to purchase. If I can remember here is the lowdown. Best to check with BF Gooderich in Akron Ohio for the boot prices.

Need larger vacuum pumps $2k
need reverse flow and control solenoids $8000 (new ?) There are getting to be really expensive and they don't exist on the surplus market.
boots about 25-30K installed (based on replacements)
contol box (right front pass side) / timers and relays $4000 ??
labour ? 40hrsX50 = 2000 +
test, weight and balance, wiring, switches, control box installation.

Total : somewhere between 40-50 k.
Then there is the hot plate for the front windshield. Last know going price is around $7000.00 used.

Best to find an aircraft with boots already installed, however, I believe there were only 50 or so mfg. with boots. could be wrong, but not a large percentage.

If you investigate further or have input, please update this as it is a re-occuring question.

bob

[SkyKing]

Bob,

Your knowledge factor concerning the de-ice plumbing option is obviously greater than mine.

Our 1977 P-model came from the factory with what's referred to as a "SNEG" option, i.e., "Full De-Ice Plumbing without the boots being installed - all lines to be capped off." Since it also came with option "41H" - Gryros, the required dual-vacuum system was already integrated, including the control solenoids, timer and relays, and as far as we can determine from log entries, all of the items you refer to as having to be bought and installed were already on the plane. Cessna also offered a "partial-plumbing" option in 1977 for $750, and it very well could have been that this option would require one to opt for the additional items as you suggest.

Our plane had the Robertson STOL kit installed first, and then the boots were put on, and having the two is a rare find.

As far as N1ZJ is concerned, it wouldn't take too much for Jazzman to determine that the items he'd eventally need for the de-ice are already installed, by pulling the right front and left rear engine cowls to see that the BFG solenoids and additional vacuum items are installed. And who knows, maybe the paperwork will reveal the original Cessna packing list that shows exactly what was installed at the factory. If indeed all of the items are there, then he'd only need boots and he'd enjoy having the best of both worlds, as this bird has R/STOL as well.

As I always recommend to a prospective purchaser, it's a good idea to order up a copy of the complete aircraft file from the FAA in Oklahoma, and then you'll have a little more insight as to its real history.

SkyKing

[SkyKing]

Forgot to mention...

The 1977 Cessna Price List shows the following:

Deice System, Propeller....$1,535
Deice System, Wing and Stabilizer....$6,325
Partial Plumbing, for Wing and Stabilizer....$705
Windshield Anti-Ice Sysytem (Pilot side only)....$720

The base price for the '77 Pressurized Skymaster II was $138,775.

So, the moral of the story is that when you can find a completely loaded P337 with zero-time engines and all the latest widgets for $198,000... the inflation factor isn't quite as bad, as say, for a Cessna T210... when all things are considered!

SkyKing

[Bob Cook]

Skyking

Yes, there were numerous options. If the solenoids and all the plumbing were installed then only the boots need to be installed. It is my understanding that most opted for just the tubing thru the bulkheads and wings and that was capped. If the solenoids etc need to be installed; you can appreciate the amount of work.

Would be prudent to check out the model numbers of the vacuum pumps (and age), check to see if the solenoids are present.

Try and find a hot plate..............

I just saw a P210 going for 300k ? hello.........

337s are really great buys. BTW I had a letter in the mail asking if I wanted to sell mine (from a Corporation).... They seemed to know what they were looking for. I know someone that was called and he sold his 337 for the going price, no questions asked. The phone call was out of the blue (in January).

That's a sign there is not many really good ones out on the market at the moment (just guessing).

Bob

what about the tks glycol de ice system? has anyone ever tried their program? JCH

[Dave Underwood]

As an FYI, I just got a quote for replacement boots from Goodrich including installation for $14 k on my 1977 FT337GP.

It was suggested that Aviall, AAR and API would also quote and give good pricing for boots only, $10 k +/- was suggested.

My A&P has said that with four of you helping, each having six hands, installation is a breeze and the most fun you have had in a long while.

Dave - N456TL

[Bob Cook]

For some reason I thought they were higher that 14k. I would definately go with BFG over the others, however, that is a personal thing. I have seen them being installed and I wouldn't want any part of it.

BFG will fix your boots and do an inspection any time you are near Akron at n/c .... Fyi

bob

[Dave Underwood]

I was quite surprised and thought that was a pretty good price. The only challenge I have with it would be getting to Akron as the plane and I are in England and it is a long way to go.

I will probably be experiencing the delights of replacing them and doing the work here. Such fun!