Pre Buy shop in Ga.
 

Has any one had work done by Sammy at Air Services in Ga CTJ airport? We are thinking of using them as the pre buy shop.
Kevin B

We used Sammy
 

Sorry for the delay in getting back to you on Arizona shops.

We actually used Sammy 2 years ago, he does know
Skymasters and in 2 hours with his 4-5 guys tearing it apart, you will know what you are getting.

I would recommend him highly.

some one else, in Atlanta, is using Sammy for their pre-buy. Excellent reports of his work

I had sammy do a prebuy on my 336. Very thorough, great job

Is There any one out there willing to talk in person about Air Services in person? if so oplease send you contact information to kbrennan@acordinc.com
Thanks

your email address bounced back.

Sorry Larry our server was down for a short time.
Kevin

The shop recomended has done work for the current owner about a year ago (the annual) as well as in the past on other aircraft. I am concerned about a bias inspection. Should I be? I must say in all fairness that everyone I have spoken to has nothing but great things to say about Sam,his shop and his knowledge of our beloved bird.
Kevin

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

an opinion.
Most shops will address the truly airworthy items, but leave the 'we shoud do this' to the discretion and pocket book of the owner.

I would not have hesitation about using the same shop. They will probably come up with things you want to address before you take delivery.

Man, I hope Larry is still speaking to me after this thread...

I disagree again. I would never use a shop that has done lots of work for the current owner to do a prebuy. Here is why.

Over the course of owning an airplane, if you take it to the same shop repeatedly, you naturally develop a relationship with the shop, hopefully one of mutual affection (or you would take it elsewhere). Now, look at it from the point of view of the mechanic. You are doing an inspection of an airplane. On the one hand, you have the owner that you have known, perhaps for years, who has paid you a lot of money, and you know to be an OK guy, maybe you know his wife, his kids, and you know how badly he needs to sell his airplane. On the other hand, you have this guy you have never heard of who comes from out of state, that you are doing the inspection for. You will probably never see this guy again.

I agree with Larry that almost all shops, any that are reputable anyway, will report the same airworthiness items to you. (The spar is cracked, the case is cracked, etc.). But there are a WHOLE lot of judgement call items that he can make a point of telling you about or not. And what I am saying is that mechanics are human, and by using the same shop the owner has a relationship with, you place the mechanic in a conflict of interest situation, and it does not work in your favor. For example, if the mechanic tells you the baffling looks sad, and is in need of replacement, later the owner is angrily saying "Hey, you didn't tell me I needed to replace the baffling last year, you told me it was 'OK for now', so why are you telling this guy it's bad? Jeez, you're killing me here..." Rather than tell you about it, the mechanic just skips it. It is "good enough", after all. Then you buy the airplane, and your new mechanic back home says "Hey, this baffling shot, we've got to replace it." And you wonder why you didn't hear about it in your prebuy...

If the shop has worked on the airplane once, a year ago, and that's it, I wouldn't worry about it, I would use them. But if there is a regular relationship between the shop and the owner, I would find another shop. For a purchase this expensive, I want a guy who works for me, and doesn't have worries about pissing off the curent owner in the back of his mind, even subconsciously.

By the way, the last mechanic I used made it a policy to never do prebuys for airplanes owned by their customers, for this same reason.

Kevin

Kevin,
I'll always speak to you.
I agree with you fundamentally. If I'm the shop owner, and I know the airplane and the guy, and I know that he needs to sell it, I'm going to do a fair, and accuarate pre-buy. It does leave lots of room for the 'judgement' things. If I'm the prospective new owner, I'm going to tell the shop to report ALL questionable things. Here, however, is where it can be messy.

My plane just came out of annual. It was difficult. I had an inexperienced A&P, and they fired the resident IA the day the annual started. The A&P said my flaps have hangar rash, and they should be replaced. Judgement call.

So, would you have someone who has never seen the plane go over it, or would you have someone who knows all the foibles go over it.

Here's my take, for what it's worth. I see both arguments, Kevin's and Larry's. But I lean a bit more to Kevin's, for yet another reason: a new mechanic may go into areas which the prior mechanic missed. I've found that mechanics develop routines. They tend to focus on the same items during an inspection, not addressing others. My mechanic, who I rave about, typically ignores avionics and landing gear; I get on his case and nudge him in those directions.

Here's a possible solution, maybe a compromise: get a pre-buy of sorts from two shops. Go first to the A&P who's been doing the work and pay him to sit with you for a couple of hours to list all the squawks over the last couple of years, all the work that's been done over the past couple of years and the areas he thinks may need work soon. Assuming the outcome of that is positive, go do a full pre-buy elsewhere with a Skymaster-savvy A&P.

I did only the former when I bought my current 337G. There were several reasons for this. I'm an engineer. I'm experienced researching compliance of AD's. It was my second Skymaster. I had assisted in the pre-buy, all annuals and most repairs of my first bird. The shop was the OSU FBO (it is owned by Ohio State University and the A&P's are employees of the University, performing maintenance by the book on the University fleet as well as private planes) and in a preliminary phone conversation with the lead A&P I judged that I would get an impartial view.

Of course, since I wasn't going to do a second pre-buy, I did a few other things at OSU, including open various inspection plates to check for corrosion, check all AD's, inspect both engine compartments, check compression, fly the plane and check for oil leaks after flight. If you adopt my suggestion, make sure to have someone technically competent with you when you interview the A&P who's been doing the work -- part of the success will depend on asking the right initial and follow-up questions.

Ernie

Sammy's shop did the O/H on the front engine when I bought my plane 6 yrs. ago and I would recommend them over anyone else I know for overall Skymaster knowledge and expertise. Sammy has bought, fixed, and resold probably over 50 himself.

Hard to beat him and his shop, in my opinion.

Thanks all for the input!!! The plane is moving to Sammy's shop this week and the pre buy will begin on the 1st of April. Hope to be joining the ranks of the Skymaster soon and maybe joining you in Ok. If I can get the required dual done in time.
Kevin B